'We have to re-adapt quickly to a long-term threat': Ex-Estonian president Kaljulaid

The former Estonian president implies that it's time for a leader from the Baltics or Eastern Europe to lead NATO – they have never had a secretary general – and pays tribute to the incumbent, Jens Stoltenberg, who has been in the job for nearly nine years.

"I'm quite sure that each and every ex-president, current president, current prime minister, of eastern European countries, would really appreciate this opportunity," Kaljulaid says. "But I also have to say that Jens Stoltenberg's shoes are very big ones to fill. He's been fantastic. He's been imaginative. He's been able to find ways to show NATO's force when NATO was really in financial difficulty and nobody was spending enough. The EFP (Enhanced Forward Presence) was a stroke of genius, and relatively cheap."

On Stoltenberg's recent assertion that "Ukraine's rightful place is in NATO", and whether that's realistic, she responds: "The process takes time, but time might also be in Ukraine's favour. First, we have to win the war. Second, we have to make sure that Ukraine is ready to join the European Union. And thereafter, the discussion will come, almost automatically, 'why not NATO?'. In Estonia we always realised, the EU first, then maybe NATO. And when we first voiced our will to join NATO, many said it should not happen; it will never happen. Yet it happened. Because we realised that we are stronger together."

Asked about what she believes should be in the 11th package of sanctions on Russia, currently under discussion by EU ambassadors, Kaljulaid answers: "I'll leave it to the government of Estonia to talk about concrete elements. But I would like to stress that the sanctions, once applied, do not stay efficient, unless you really check all the time that they are